British Telecom’s Partnership with Juniper Networks

00:05 today we have with us neil mcrae

00:08 managing director of architecture and

00:10 strategy for british telecom group he's

00:12 the chief architect

00:14 neil welcome how are you doing today

00:16 i'm great blake very inspired by your uh

00:19 presentation and and i

00:21 you know i used to thought i think i was

00:23 customer focused but i've learned a lot

00:25 in 20 minutes

00:28 wow thank you so much for that um you've

00:30 had a really long standing partnership

00:32 with juniper

00:34 um it's helped british telecom quite a

00:36 bit i've heard can you talk about the

00:38 background of the partnership and why

00:40 you chose to work with juniper networks

00:44 look yeah i mean pt's been working with

00:46 uh juniper networks i mean literally

00:48 since juniper started as a

00:51 a as a as a company

00:53 that set out to change the network in

00:56 business and be much more customer

00:58 focused

01:00 um you know the back back when juniper

01:02 started there wasn't a lot of choice

01:04 there wasn't

01:05 um there wasn't the choices that we have

01:07 today and and frankly there was a an

01:10 incumbent that wasn't doing as great a

01:11 job as as actually the network needed

01:14 um and for us to work with juniper was

01:17 was really easy because they were

01:20 focused on customer outcomes and

01:22 customer experiences

01:23 and improving the the offer that we as

01:26 telecommunication

01:28 operators make

01:30 and made it very easy for us to work

01:32 with them and not only that

01:34 and back to your point about listening

01:36 to your customers

01:37 having worked with juniper over over

01:40 you know 10 15 years now juniper are

01:43 huge listeners and will take ideas from

01:46 customers even even ideas that are maybe

01:48 perhaps a little bit borderline

01:51 and you know take a risk and

01:53 and co-collaborate with with with our

01:55 customers to build something that makes

01:57 a big difference to our customers and as

02:00 and you're right to say blake well our

02:02 relationship with juniper is b2b

02:05 but my customers are all b2c

02:09 awesome so you've got a little elon musk

02:11 and you know taking those taking that

02:13 those customer ideas and really actually

02:15 doing something with them

02:17 yeah i mean i think customers are the

02:19 experts of using our service and and you

02:23 know quite often we're focused in

02:25 particular in telco land of you know how

02:27 do we sell it and then how do we build

02:29 it

02:30 actually the biggest part of the service

02:32 we offer blake is how do customers use

02:34 our service you know how do they take

02:36 their smartphone out how what experience

02:38 are they getting wherever they are

02:41 be it at home be it on the move be it at

02:44 work and we want to understand

02:47 every detail of what they're doing

02:49 understand how we can improve that

02:51 experience and all manners of

02:54 of what our customers are doing and and

02:57 you know the platform that juniper

02:59 announcing today

03:00 really allows us to do that and get much

03:02 more insight and actually go a step

03:04 further blake which is actually how do

03:07 we predict what our customers are going

03:09 to ask us for

03:10 before before they ask it and and turn

03:13 that into a actually customer here's

03:15 something you didn't think you need but

03:17 now you've got it

03:18 you'll never be able to live without it

03:20 and that's that's the kind of customer

03:22 experience journey at bt we're trying to

03:24 deliver and with the platform juniper

03:26 announced today that really helps us on

03:29 that journey

03:31 right because it's really about

03:32 anticipating the need of the customer

03:34 and personalizing it because

03:36 neil you and i know that feels amazing

03:39 when a company has done the extra

03:41 legwork to think

03:42 what might we need next where are we

03:45 going um let's talk about customer

03:47 experience in telco and telecom

03:50 we know when our networks don't work

03:52 well you know this is a very tough

03:54 industry from what i hear

03:56 can you talk about what a great customer

03:58 experience in telecom looks like and how

04:00 has that changed over the years

04:03 yeah i mean i think a great question

04:05 blake i mean

04:06 the way i look at it is you know

04:09 and the way i picture service in my head

04:12 is

04:13 you know when you go to a kind of a

04:14 really top hotel

04:16 and you ask for a cup of coffee

04:19 and then mysteriously the cup of coffee

04:21 appears you just you know it's almost

04:23 like it it's almost like it was beamed

04:25 in from somewhere versus you know a not

04:28 so great place where you hear 15 people

04:31 shouting fred wants a coffee jake once

04:33 you know and you hear all this kind of

04:35 noise and and they spill it as as

04:37 they're walking out what the experience

04:39 that we're trying to build in in telco

04:41 and mbt

04:42 is very much that when you when you need

04:44 something it's there it's available you

04:47 know how to use it and and and the

04:50 expectation that that you need we've

04:53 already anticipated now we've got a long

04:55 way to go

04:56 we've you know we've we've

04:58 we've made telco too complex

05:01 we've given you too much choice we've

05:03 tried to be

05:04 smart and giving too many choices when

05:06 actually keeping it simple and focusing

05:09 on the areas of value that customers

05:11 want you know most customers want to

05:14 know how much data can i use or actually

05:16 can i use my phone without worrying

05:18 about build shock you know we've we've

05:20 worked to

05:21 to in that direction hugely but also we

05:25 actually want to extend

05:27 what we do into

05:29 your daily life even more so you know

05:31 many people think what's you know what

05:33 is a partner is a telco play if i buy a

05:36 a ticket to a baseball game

05:38 and and actually what we want to do is

05:41 from the minute we know that you've

05:42 bought a ticket to that game to when

05:44 you're seated in this in the baseball

05:46 stadium watching the game and you've got

05:49 a beer in one hand and a hot dog in the

05:51 other hand we want to optimize the

05:53 network and optimize that whole

05:55 experience

05:56 from the minute you leave your home to

05:58 the minute the game ends and and again

06:00 the platform that juniper's building

06:02 gives us that insight as to how do

06:04 people behave in in a baseball stadium

06:07 how do people

06:08 want to get

06:09 information delivered to them how do

06:12 they want to actually get to the stadium

06:13 how do they want to leave and we've got

06:15 a huge amount of data on insight blake

06:18 that we can use

06:19 to to not just improve the service for

06:21 us but to partner with that stadium that

06:24 improves that whole experience of going

06:26 to a baseball game

06:28 yeah because now neil the the phone is

06:30 part of the experience of the game like

06:32 if you left your phone at home and

06:34 you're at a baseball game i would think

06:37 that would be a huge tragedy

06:39 yeah you you probably your tickets are

06:41 probably on it your your you know uber

06:43 app to get there and backs probably on

06:45 it or you know you're if you're meeting

06:48 friends how do they know where to meet

06:49 you

06:50 you know there is and you you know if

06:52 you're using a payment scheme that's on

06:54 your phone you know you we've become

06:56 so dependent upon these devices that you

06:59 know and

07:01 that when we don't have them it's very

07:03 challenging but you know we're all about

07:06 trying to understand what the behaviors

07:08 are and using that knowledge to make the

07:10 next step of every customer or every

07:13 every end user's journey a much easier

07:16 step and and you know we've we've had

07:18 some great successes but you know i talk

07:20 about baseball as an example here in the

07:22 uk you know soccer's the big sport here

07:25 at wembley stadium the the the scenario

07:28 that i just envisioned we've actually

07:29 deployed that we optimize our network

07:31 from when people get off the train

07:34 at wembley station

07:36 all the way into the stadium and all the

07:37 way back out and yes it does require you

07:40 you need you need your handset um but i

07:42 think you know the the

07:44 that's that's one part of where we're

07:47 headed in customer experience the other

07:49 part of customer experience is actually

07:51 using the network in these venues in a

07:53 much more in-depth way to improve every

07:57 aspect of that experience as as a whole

07:59 be it be how you buy your beer to the

08:03 information that's displayed you know if

08:05 if if if you know we've been even

08:08 talking with you if you know that you've

08:09 got a relative or a special guest in in

08:12 the in the stadium put some messages up

08:15 on the displays to to recognize that

08:17 that people are there and it's really

08:19 easy for us to do that

08:21 if we've got the insight and if we get

08:23 that data from a platform

08:25 um like the insight platform that

08:27 juniper are talking about today

08:29 yeah because you know a kisscam moment

08:31 that could make the whole experience for

08:33 everyone in the stadium 20 000 people

08:36 in all honesty i'm thinking about soccer

08:39 in europe because i've been watching a

08:41 lot of ted lasso along with every other

08:43 american so i'm glad we're talking about

08:46 sports right now and let's talk about

08:48 automation

08:50 automation is a really hot topic right

08:52 now but

08:53 it's so important as we think as i.t

08:55 professionals and about technology how

08:57 to balance

08:59 the human element which is so important

09:01 and incorporate that into how we build

09:03 experiences so how are you balancing

09:06 automation and ai and how are you

09:09 maintaining that human element in

09:11 everything that you build

09:14 yeah i mean

09:15 i think your your

09:16 your point about listening to your

09:18 customers is really important here that

09:20 you know we have customers that never

09:21 want to talk to our machine and we and

09:23 we can identify them and we can we can

09:25 build journeys for them but we have

09:27 other customers as you say that never

09:29 want to talk to a human they just want

09:31 to be able to press a button or make

09:33 something happen and we build journeys

09:35 you know

09:36 multi-directional journeys through our

09:38 through our it

09:40 and and and understand and personalize

09:42 that so our own you know our mye app on

09:45 our on that you get with a phone when

09:47 you buy it from us can help you decide

09:49 that journey

09:50 automation for us though

09:52 is is how do we

09:54 how do we run and maintain the network

09:56 whilst and give no interruption to to

09:59 customers so through the pandemic you

10:01 know more of us became much more reliant

10:03 on the network and it was all about how

10:05 do we build and grow and change the

10:08 network in a way that customers never

10:11 ever

10:11 feel that we've that we've done it and

10:13 and that was crucially important during

10:16 the pandemic and we learned the huge um

10:18 about automation and the ways to deploy

10:21 it but also a different mindset about

10:23 how do you build for automation how do

10:25 you build for the experience where in a

10:28 world where everyone was dependent upon

10:30 network it just can't not be there so

10:32 that really changed our thinking and

10:34 actually in some respects the pandemic

10:36 made us think differently than what we

10:39 would have done and brought things

10:40 forward and because because people were

10:43 relying upon us in a bigger way than

10:45 than we ever imagined

10:47 absolutely i think during covet

10:49 i think it's a silver lining for

10:52 customer experience and for the whole

10:54 business world that we had to be more

10:56 digital we had to think about the

10:59 digital customer using our network

11:01 focusing more on online communication

11:04 and we had to really beef up what we

11:06 were doing and i think that it's for me

11:08 the one positive because of course you

11:10 and i have been advocates for customer

11:12 experience in digital for many many

11:13 years

11:14 and now we've learned okay we can

11:16 provide so many more experiences

11:18 digitally than we thought we could

11:20 let's talk about

11:22 keeping things easy for customers and

11:25 simple

11:26 you've talked about the fact that

11:28 customers don't really like complication

11:31 how do you architect the network to make

11:34 sure that you're reducing complexity

11:37 even though customer expectations are

11:39 constantly changing so we're in a very

11:41 complex world but we have to keep things

11:43 simple so how would you recommend others

11:46 do that

11:47 and yeah i mean that's a great question

11:50 i think

11:51 in my mind you know i always try and put

11:53 myself into customer shoes you know

11:56 what type of customer what type of

11:58 persona is this customer can we what

12:00 data do we know about this customer what

12:03 you know who in our organization is like

12:05 this customer that we're trying to we're

12:07 trying to work with and then and then

12:09 from that build um the kind of

12:12 here here is what we predict around this

12:14 customer here's what we've seen before

12:16 here's what you know and and in covert

12:18 we went back to previous um data to know

12:22 how is the network going to perform as

12:24 as effectively the traffic doubled and

12:27 the busy period of our network moved

12:28 from the evening to the day because

12:31 everybody was at home uh whilst lockdown

12:33 was on so it was all about using data

12:36 and insight about how our customers

12:39 behave how the network behaves and

12:41 actually reaching out to our partners

12:42 like juniper and some of our other

12:44 partners on the content side people like

12:46 netflix and saying hey we think we're

12:48 going to see this what do you think and

12:50 and and actually i think customers

12:52 appreciate it when you understand who

12:55 they

12:56 use in their ecosystem each customer has

12:58 its own individual ecosystem and the

13:00 more that you can predict around that

13:01 ecosystem and the more that you can

13:03 they'll build your own bridge in that

13:05 ecosystem then so much the better and

13:07 and you know one one simple thing that

13:09 we did that was huge

13:11 um during the pandemic we connected all

13:14 of the alexas that are on our network to

13:16 be able to use our phone system so you

13:18 could dial from alexa um and and it and

13:21 that for some some of our customers was

13:23 massive because it was an easy way for

13:25 people to to chat and communicate and if

13:28 you had the alexa with screen you could

13:29 you could do video conferencing as well

13:31 and and we recognized that that was

13:33 valuable because we could see those

13:34 relationships and and what people were

13:36 doing in the network

13:38 yeah alexa on video actually babysat my

13:42 daughter because my daughter i was

13:43 pregnant my daughter was home from

13:45 preschool because they were closed and

13:46 so and we had no family around so

13:48 grandma would

13:50 and grandpa would entertain my daughter

13:52 through the alexa echo on video and

13:54 honestly it really helped a lot one hour

13:57 a day i knew that i had that help for my

13:59 daughter to teach her how to read um

14:01 let's talk about the evolving role of

14:03 telco companies i mean telecom is a

14:06 tough space customers demand these

14:09 seamless zero for

14:11 zero friction customer experiences how

14:13 has telecom

14:15 how has it evolved changed what are your

14:17 predictions

14:19 yeah predictions i mean i've i think how

14:21 has it changed i think we've realized

14:23 that

14:24 you know telecoms was very much our

14:27 milk the cow business you know you had a

14:29 cash cow

14:30 and you and you milked it for you could

14:32 get i think what we've realized

14:34 certainly over the last three or four

14:36 years and and certainly being

14:37 accelerated by the pandemic that

14:39 actually we've got to innovate and work

14:41 with our customers be it business or

14:43 consumers we've got to do much about

14:46 being there for them and in some

14:48 respects we've allowed competing

14:50 companies you could argue you know a lot

14:52 of people argue that the hyperscalers

14:53 are big telecommunication um you know

14:56 competitors i actually think they're

14:58 partners um but you know people say that

15:01 well you've you know you've kind of been

15:03 milking your car whilst these guys have

15:05 been going out you know building huge

15:07 huge platforms to take your customers

15:10 away so you know we've learned that you

15:12 know you've got to move with customers

15:14 and actually to some extent you you

15:16 might also have to push customers along

15:18 a little bit because for their own good

15:21 and understanding what technology and

15:23 what the power of telecommunications can

15:24 do for them both individually but also

15:27 as businesses and and that

15:29 co-collaboration and building um

15:32 solutions with customers has become

15:34 hugely important and my prediction is

15:38 you know i i see us i see the network

15:40 becoming more and more part of our daily

15:42 lives uh we talk about clarify i talk

15:44 about networkify which is

15:47 the network enabling new experiences for

15:49 people that just wouldn't have been

15:50 possible before one of my proudest

15:52 moments was um a group of buskers and

15:56 and artists during the pandemic

15:58 came together to put a song

16:00 about 100 of them to put a song together

16:03 over the network to raise money for for

16:06 covered research and charity and that

16:08 would never have happened without the

16:10 network um and it's a phenomenal thing

16:12 and and you know those sort of

16:14 experiences i want to see more and more

16:16 of them i want that to be a daily norm

16:18 that we see people like that coming

16:19 together to really um provide

16:22 experiences that only the network can

16:25 provide and and then and then taking

16:27 that forward i think we'll see

16:29 the network becoming more important in

16:30 healthcare i see we'll

16:33 we'll see the network becoming more and

16:34 more important in transportation

16:36 and actually everything that we do i

16:38 think the network will become more

16:39 important and i'm i'm super excited

16:41 about that but it means that we need

16:42 that insight we need to know what's

16:44 happening in the network so that we can

16:46 build it scale it grow it run it and

16:49 give it customers that excellent

16:50 experience so actually blake

16:53 they're not thinking about the

16:54 telecommunication provider because

16:56 everything's running really smoothly

16:58 that's that's kind of my my vision

17:02 neil i think that the things you're

17:04 saying today will resonate with

17:05 everybody watching because we're all

17:07 dealing with increased complexity while

17:10 customers have more expectations from us

17:12 and we have to deliver on the

17:13 expectation and almost be like a

17:15 magician like i talked about working in

17:17 the background where customers don't

17:19 really think about us but everything is

17:21 just magically working and that's all

17:23 they care about neil i want to thank you

17:25 for being with us today to share some of

17:27 your insights about your work and your

17:29 partnership with

17:30 juniper you're welcome thanks blake

17:34 actually um neil if you have a couple

17:36 minutes uh we do have some questions

17:38 from the from the analysts um so let me

17:40 uh just kind of fire a few at you um you

17:43 know first of all the first question is

17:46 delivering a differentiated experience

17:47 is certainly a priority for operators

17:49 like bt but also a challenge and you

17:51 talked a little bit about about that why

17:53 is it a challenge and what what is bt

17:55 doing about it to change that challenge

17:58 yeah i mean it's a challenge for for

18:00 many reasons it can be as simple as i

18:02 don't have coverage where i'm going or

18:04 where i need to be and and you know we

18:06 continually uh build out coverage and

18:08 capability but it can also be around how

18:11 their

18:12 device works i you know in the network

18:15 you know some people are super technical

18:17 some people aren't and and one of the

18:19 things we're doing you know we stood up

18:21 um again

18:23 we did this just ahead of the pandemic

18:25 so in some respects perhaps lucky but we

18:26 stood up and a bunch of tech areas that

18:30 allow our customers to understand and be

18:33 educated on how they get the most out of

18:35 the network for us our biggest challenge

18:37 is you know and and i'll

18:40 this won't surprise anybody but it's

18:42 about skill sets and and hiring people

18:45 have got great technical knowledge think

18:47 customer first think security first and

18:50 and and think

18:52 you know how they can build stuff that

18:54 innovates and makes a difference and

18:55 uses the network to do it so

18:57 from from my perspective the the biggest

19:00 challenge is

19:01 is is getting those skills in and on

19:04 board and being active to build what our

19:07 customers are demanding from us

19:09 that makes a lot of sense and certainly

19:10 it's a it's a major shift for for a lot

19:12 of us that are moving in this direction

19:14 another question and you heard a little

19:16 bit this morning about our focus around

19:19 ai how aggressive is bt with ai and how

19:21 do you balance that with possibly

19:24 disrupting customer experience

19:26 yeah luca i think um

19:29 you've got to experiment i mean if

19:30 you're not experimenting you might as

19:31 well just i don't know do something

19:33 different

19:34 is experimentation is key and actually

19:37 that's the other thing that i think we

19:39 as we as telcos have had to learn to do

19:41 more of we've always been slightly

19:43 slightly nervous about breaking things

19:45 um actually with new cloud technology

19:48 it's easier to test stuff

19:49 um than it's ever been before and it's

19:51 easier to run things without having a

19:53 big impact and and and that's one of the

19:56 big benefits of of

19:58 our bt network cloud that juniper is a

20:00 huge partner of i think the second part

20:02 to that is bt has more patents and ai

20:05 than any other company in the uk

20:08 um

20:09 we are leading at the front of ai we've

20:11 developed many ai based solutions in our

20:13 for our contact centers

20:15 for traveling and logistics

20:19 and we partner with

20:20 with people to test

20:22 that ai and ensure it's making the

20:25 outcome that we think it's making

20:27 one of the biggest challenges with ai is

20:29 when you build it the only test that

20:32 you've got for it is the expert that

20:33 you've got to say well is the ai doing

20:35 it right or not and so you still need to

20:38 have strong skills you still need to

20:39 have strong capabilities but if you're

20:41 building ai to service customers you

20:43 need to go out there and listen to

20:45 customers and take feedback on how

20:46 that's performing and a lot and again

20:49 we've built ai to do that so

20:51 it's it's a never-ending um journey but

20:54 but i think

20:55 you know

20:56 again one of the other skill benefits is

20:59 you know if if you're doing ai don't

21:01 have an ai department and democratize ai

21:04 build it into all the all the

21:05 curriculums of your engineers and the

21:07 people that are working in marketing

21:09 give them the power to use ai and and

21:12 and then use their own expertise and

21:14 intelligence to put two and two together

21:16 but for us you know the the one of the

21:18 biggest um aspects of the pandemic day

21:22 one are prime minister boris johnson on

21:24 tv and rai changed a whole chunk of

21:27 traffic

21:28 paths throughout the network because we

21:30 had a whole lot of people wanting to

21:32 watch him to understand what was going

21:34 on we couldn't have done that humans

21:36 could not have done it and we would have

21:38 provided a bad experience had it not

21:40 been for ai so for us

21:43 as they as the network gets more

21:44 complicated because of the demands that

21:46 our customers are putting on it ai is in

21:49 our future we haven't we really don't

21:50 have a choice because humans aren't fast

21:53 enough and and i've talked to juniper um

21:56 i've talked to juniper teams about this

21:57 before what triggered this for us was

22:00 the olympics in 20 2012 when we hosted

22:02 him in london

22:03 usain bolt took 10 seconds to run 100

22:06 meters and we didn't know

22:09 in that 10 second period

22:11 whether anyone had seen it because the

22:14 tooling in the systems back then just

22:16 couldn't cope with a quantum of 10

22:18 seconds

22:20 customer satisfaction quantum is less

22:23 than a second

22:24 and if you're not building a platform

22:26 that can cope second by second even

22:29 millisecond by millisecond to understand

22:31 what's going on for your customers

22:33 you're in trouble and that's very much

22:35 the mindset that we've had in bt and

22:38 jointly with juniper i may have to steal

22:40 that quote neil that was really wise

22:41 about the about the customer kind of

22:43 satisfaction uh quantum okay last

22:46 question it's a big question and

22:47 unfortunately i need a short answer um

22:49 so the question is about service

22:51 provider revenues you know i've been

22:52 challenged to grow

22:54 but we know there are many opportunities

22:55 so from your perspective what can

22:57 operators like bt do to better monetize

22:59 their network investment and or find new

23:01 sources of revenue

23:03 look i mentioned some of that in the

23:05 discussion with blake how do we take the

23:07 network beyond where we've taken it

23:09 before and how do we enable it in ways

23:11 that people haven't thought about so i

23:13 use my wembley stadium um you know

23:17 um use case where from the minute you

23:19 get off a train to the minute you're

23:20 sitting in the seat we're using the

23:22 network to make your whole experience

23:23 better using video using sensors using

23:26 the fact that you know how what you paid

23:29 with where your phone is taking all of

23:31 that data working with the stadium as a

23:33 partner working with the transportation

23:35 customer sorry transportation systems as

23:37 a partner and building the easiest

23:40 solution so that you're never worried

23:42 you know you're never thinking about

23:44 when's that train going to turn up or am

23:46 i going to get to the to the bar and get

23:48 my hot dog quickly am i going to miss

23:50 some of the game

23:51 using all of that and symphony and

23:53 orchestrating in a way that provides an

23:55 outstanding customer experience

23:57 customers will you know you heard it

23:59 from blake customers will pay for that

24:01 and we believe we can grab on to a big

24:03 chunk of that cash

24:05 well thank you so much neil and blake

24:06 i'll turn it back over to you to kind of

24:08 transition to our next guest

24:10 thank you neil i've really enjoyed

24:12 hearing from you and i think all of us

24:14 can imagine what that 10 seconds with

24:17 hussein bolt look like and you were

24:19 probably sweating a little bit

24:22 worried that things weren't working out

24:24 but that's the job of running the

24:26 network is it's very high pressure

24:28 almost as high pressure as being hussein

24:30 volt sprinting in front of you know

24:33 5 billion people