Leveraging Automation for Reliable Data Center Operations | Juniper Global Summit 2022

0:07 Hello everyone.

0:08 My name's Mike Bushong,

0:09 and I'm Vice President of Data Center Product Management at Juniper.

0:13 Today, we're going to talk about data center automation

0:15 and the benefits it brings to planning, design, and operations.

0:19 If done correctly, it maximizes both reliability and speed

0:23 resulting in better user and data center operator experiences.

0:27 Joining me today is Ernest Altbart, who's IT architect for Raiffeisen Informatik.

0:33 Ernest, welcome and thank you for joining us today.

0:36 Hi, Mike. Thanks for having me.

0:38 Before we get into data center operations and automation,

0:42 maybe you can tell us a bit about what Raiffeisen does.

0:46 We have been providing IT services for financial and insurance companies

0:50 for more than 50 years focusing on the content as well.

0:54 Not just the IT aspect, but also the business aspects of the services we provide and have,

0:59 of course, proceeded over 50 years

1:03 to various stages of services and up to now have become a full-blown

1:07 service provider for these institutions and on the vision on top of that,

1:12 of course, also a data center provider

1:14 and with along all the network elements that come along with the data center.

1:20 Perfect. With the network, you've got new elements of networking, as you imagine.

1:24 Tell us a bit about what Juniper does relative to your overall mission.

1:30 We have been deploying Juniper Solutions ever since 2010

1:34 where we started with the single SRX cluster.

1:36 In 2014, we have moved on to a service provider core as we call it.

1:41 It's a transmission network based on Juniper routers

1:44 and have recently upgraded our data center fabric

1:48 with the app store solutions and QFX switches.

1:52 We'll proceed over the next year also to implement an SD-WAN solution

1:56 by Juniper which we will use in our subsidiary networks.

2:03 That's the short story of a long run actually.

2:07 You hit a couple of things there.

2:08 You hit SD-WAN, we've obviously hit intent-based networking with the Apstra bits.

2:13 There's the trends that are going on.

2:14 Maybe you can talk a bit about what the drivers are behind

2:18 how you think about your data center evolving.

2:23 The main drivers from a business side are, of course,

2:27 the abstraction that customers demand.

2:31 You'll know about hyper-scaling clouds out there.

2:34 That's typically a level of demand that the customers now have.

2:39 They want private clouds, they want containerization,

2:42 they want infrastructure abstraction.

2:45 They don't want to push out orders anymore for certain

2:49 application-specific infrastructures,

2:51 but what they want is self-service aspects, portaling,

2:55 want to do it themselves, want to implement platforms,

2:58 not necessarily applications.

3:01 There's lots of things that are going about microservices and rapid deployments,

3:07 rapid changes in the application infrastructure

3:10 that can only be achieved by automation, by API integration.

3:14 That's the business side of things.

3:16 On the infrastructure, of course, you have to match that to a certain extent.

3:20 You have to have the ability to be flexible enough,

3:23 but to have a standardized operation on the same level.

3:26 Not that the feature parameters and issues actually overwhelm you in the end.

3:34 Keeping control and abstract at the same time,

3:36 I think that will be one of the main challenges we face

3:40 and that's one of the main drivers business-wise.

3:43 When it comes to the management side of things,

3:46 I think people are the main driver when it comes to implementing solutions

3:51 because the management aspect becomes more and more difficult

3:54 and becomes more and more complex even and complicated.

3:58 As I mentioned, a lot of parameters, lots of changes,

4:00 there's lots of things we have to keep under control and people in our industry,

4:07 as you might know, I guess, there's never enough of them.

4:13 In the networking area specifically, we,

4:16 at least in Europe see a huge problem coming up

4:20 when it comes to the generation gap in the networking area.

4:24 There's not many young guys coming after our seniors.

4:29 There is a huge demand for networking people on the general industry.

4:35 There's lots of competition going on.

4:37 There's people coming and going in all over the companies.

4:40 Luckily, this isn't the case in our company.

4:42 Raiffeisen Informatik is a very stable employer, but we do not get

4:46 all that many people on board for the reasons I just cited.

4:51 Therefore, you have to do more with the same amount of people.

4:55 The infrastructures, the applications get more complex,

4:57 get more complicated, and it's really,

4:59 really of utmost importance to keep control of your infrastructure.

5:05 When you look at a standard VPN, your excellent fabric as it is today,

5:09 there's lots of parameters to be configured all the time

5:12 and to be kept in control of all the time with the same amount of people,

5:17 with the same sizes of teams doing more is, of course,

5:22 a major challenge when it comes to implementing something new

5:26 and on top of your current infrastructure.

5:29 I would say those two would be pretty much the main drivers

5:33 amongst many others for our business.

5:36 You mentioned the word overwhelm.

5:37 When you look at the pace of change, starting with cloud and then,

5:43 things like Automation, DevOps, Cloud Native, Kubernetes,

5:49 just the pace of change is crazy.

5:50 It's hard to imagine individuals working in the environment,

5:54 not being overwhelmed.

5:56 Looking to tools and processes to help, I think it's a huge challenge.

6:02 Just on the people side, staying there, you talked a bit about folks

6:06 being recruited away, you talked about the risk of bringing in

6:11 juniors when you've got folks who've been there for a while

6:14 and change in skillset.

6:18 From an individual perspective, even beyond the business,

6:21 can you talk a bit about what challenges your people are seeing

6:24 just in terms of how they operate things.

6:26 How are they facing all of this overwhelming change?

6:31 Of course, one way of coping with that, is standardization.

6:36 Standardize as much as you can.

6:38 That's one way of doing it.

6:39 Automation is key, as well, because once you standardize,

6:43 you have a very good base for automation, and you can easily do that.

6:48 Of course, there is insight necessary all the time.

6:51 There is a thing of keeping the control over the standards you

6:56 created and the automation layer you have put in place, whatever that is.

7:01 That needs to be something you can easily rely on all the time

7:04 and not worry about it because once you do that,

7:08 you just created an additional problem for you and didn't solve one in the first place.

7:13 From an individual point of view, we had funny discussions, actually,

7:18 in the selection of our data center fabric management solution,

7:23 which has been always Apstra.

7:25 When we approached our senior administrators who have been doing

7:30 their networking job for the last 25 years, most of that, of course

7:36 manually over a very long time, even they looked at the length of parameters,

7:44 at the number of parameters,

7:46 at the problem of being able to control all that in a very short amount of time.

7:54 Even they said, "Well, okay, in that case, we need to go for automation."

7:58 I can very clearly see that.

8:00 That was a milestone in our selection process as then but the mindset has switched.

8:08 We looked for automating more or less exclusively,

8:12 and more or less disregarded the traditional configuration aspect of the components.

8:17 This is where you guys can come in, actually.

8:21 Along those lines, obviously, data center fabrics, EVPN plays a big role.

8:25 Maybe we can get a bit more into some of the specifics

8:28 as you're talking about the things that people have to manage relative to EVPN.

8:32 You already referenced that there's a whole set of parameters that

8:35 people have to pay attention to, to keep current and adjust

8:39 continuously as the data centers operating.

8:42 Maybe we can talk a bit about the challenges inherent to managing

8:46 broad EVPN-type environments.

8:48 First of all, like I said that the sheer number of parameters

8:52 is something that you need to take into account.

8:56 The use, the intent you have with that fabric, what are you doing with it?

9:02 What are you connecting it to?

9:05 I might mention there that we have a 50-year legacy and that there's a

9:09 whole lot of traditional data center that also needs to be

9:11 connected to newer fabric of sorts.

9:15 This is where a whole new set of feature comes in.

9:19 Of course, keeping all that is a major challenge.

9:23 Intent is one thing but keeping it is a totally different thing.

9:28 That's difficult to achieve, I might add.

9:33 I'd say that also integrating and interfacing is a huge challenge

9:39 and will be a huge challenge in that regard.

9:42 We try to tackle that by running a two-sided approach.

9:47 We target the network automation on the one hand and target the rest of

9:52 the data center automation on the other.

9:55 We purposefully didn't integrate the software-defined data center

9:59 as we currently deploy it and the network fabric, as we thought that

10:03 might be too big a step at this point in time because once you do

10:08 it all at the same time, it becomes additionally difficult.

10:12 Those, I would see are the main challenges and, in the future,

10:15 of course, then the integration will be of utmost importance.

10:19 I mentioned SD-WAN earlier which has similar approaches,

10:23 then you have the network fabric,

10:25 you have a software-defined data center of sorts depending on your stack,

10:29 and managing all those together,

10:31 getting an abstraction for the network layer,

10:33 that's especially important for cloud interconnect and stuff like that.

10:38 Those will pose, I think challenges on a company, on an organizational,

10:42 and on an individual base because keeping track of all that alone is

10:47 a challenge in and of itself.

10:50 It's crazy on a complexity that creeps in, even in short periods of time.

10:54 You mentioned something I want to call attention to.

10:57 You said 50 years of legacy that we have to deal with,

11:01 that's unimaginable for most of us.

11:04 Along with that, obviously, it's not just changing technologies,

11:07 there is different generations of equipment, there's different

11:11 generations of companies and suppliers,

11:14 and that means that your environment

11:15 is going to naturally be or arrive at multi-vendor.

11:19 Maybe we can talk a bit about this vendor independence and the role

11:24 it plays because you're planning an environment that has to not just work today,

11:29 but it's got to continue to work as things change.

11:32 Can you talk a bit about how vendor independence--

11:35 How you think about that and even plan for it?

11:39 Vendor independence is always something my companies have strived for in the past.

11:45 Usually by dispersing vendors over certain solutions say storage,

11:50 for instance, there's a couple of storage providers we employ of course,

11:55 that gives you at least strategic options once something happens

11:59 to one or the other suppliers that has happened in the past,

12:02 but being vendor-independent also gives you, of course,

12:05 a lot of assurance when it comes to the

12:08 standardization and automation I mentioned earlier.

12:11 This is one aspect why we always strive for vendor independence

12:17 as we didn't want to be dependent from one of these vendors.

12:23 There's a funny story, actually, I should mention here.

12:26 Our purchasing department, as you might imagine, is one of the,

12:30 if not the strongest driver of being vendor-independent because it gives

12:34 them leverage to do their job well.

12:38 When they can compare offers, when they can compare RFPs,

12:41 when dealing out RFIs, they can very easily compare

12:45 and actually set the best price and the best solution based on that,

12:48 given all the technical requirements are met.

12:52 Once, we did employ the Apstra mechanic here and showed them that

12:58 now we can actually change

13:02 the hardware vendor underneath the solution if you want.

13:06 They were like, yay, that's what we always dreamt of.

13:09 It was basically their dream come true.

13:12 I have to add, this is, of course, still a dream but it is more

13:17 realized now with that Apstra solution than it was in the past

13:23 and any other management solution

13:26 we have seen and deployed in any area, in any field.

13:30 This is something they really, really liked.

13:33 That was interesting to get that feedback in the RFP process.

13:37 That was a major plus point for a management solution like Apstra here,

13:42 that we could abstract the hardware manufacturer

13:46 from the software management stack.

13:49 That's just one funny side aspect of that

13:53 but maybe worthwhile for the purchasing departments.

13:57 On the technical side of things, of course,

13:58 it gives you an independence and an assurance of you

14:01 can continue to manage your infrastructure in much the same way as you did before,

14:05 even if you have to change the vendor.

14:08 There was an actual application already for that.

14:11 You of all people are well aware of that chip crisis that's going on.

14:16 We have felt the effects of that

14:18 where we usually have delivery times of 6 to maybe 12 weeks.

14:23 All of a sudden it has become the same amount in months.

14:27 When dealing out our RFP,

14:29 we actually said to every manufacturer that was on the shortlist.

14:32 We said, "If you can deliver sooner,

14:36 let us know because it might be the decisive factor here."

14:39 It might actually swing the decision your way

14:42 because we knew when we had a solution like Apstra in place,

14:47 we could actually do that.

14:49 It changed nothing from the way we are going to manage our data center fabric tomorrow.

14:55 It was just a different hardware underneath with maybe a little screw

15:00 and a little tinkering here and there

15:02 when it came to the configurer or sort of stuff like that.

15:04 We simply didn't worry about that.

15:06 We had a shortlist of the-- fine.

15:09 Whoever can deliver first, good.

15:11 Luckily, it was Juniper who delivered first because that gave us--

15:16 through the acquisition of Apstra gave us a strategic advantage

15:19 when it came to the ecosystem of the solution because when it comes to support lines,

15:24 contract management, contacts like you have here,

15:28 it, of course, is a huge advantage to have that in the same environment

15:32 and with the same content and with the same channels.

15:36 In the RFP itself, we actually could discount

15:39 the hardware manufacturer and that is a huge advantage.

15:42 I think that's also inherent in the solution

15:46 and that's really something we valued but luckily didn't have to act upon.

15:54 Using architectural means to mitigate enterprise risk is huge.

15:59 I don't know that I've ever seen a celebratory procurement team but it's nice doing that.

16:05 This was the first for me too.

16:08 Maybe we can take it just one step further.

16:11 There is an architectural principle and a reason for going in the direction, I guess.

16:15 What are the results of that?

16:17 Have we seen operational tangible benefits that

16:22 really drive Raiffeisen's infrastructure going forward?

16:25 Yes. I pointed it out earlier.

16:27 I'd say that the main advantage is we can now keep the intent.

16:34 Intent-based networking sets an intent first,

16:37 which is all nice and well, but keeping it is a major advantage for us.

16:42 As you might imagine, with 50 years of legacy and three data centers,

16:47 we run a broad base of customers in financial and insurance companies,

16:54 lots of demands, lots of flexibility needed.

16:57 When you have standardization in place,

17:00 it disperses quite quickly with customer demand.

17:04 Being able to keep the intent is I think the main advantage here for us.

17:12 I'd say that, of course, the deployment is a lot nicer,

17:20 a lot easier than it has been in the past.

17:23 Though, given the application lifecycle, this never was a deciding factor for us.

17:28 It's never a KPI in Raiffeisen.

17:31 How fast the switch is deployed,

17:33 but it's very, very nice that it just takes a day and it's done as compared to the past.

17:41 There's that, and of course,

17:44 there is visibility and of course that the ability to train people

17:50 has become much quicker than it has before.

17:54 Imagine you have to take somebody through Junos, IOS,

17:59 and other networking operation configuration courses.

18:02 All you have to do now is actually tell them how to work with Apstra.

18:08 You can disregard to a certain amount,

18:10 the actual hardware and operating system knicks

18:14 and knacks as there is that abstraction.

18:17 That's the top three that come to mind or fairly quickly here

18:22 when it comes to the actual advantages.

18:27 I'd say also as I mentioned it earlier,

18:29 the changing of the mindset is a side advantage that has huge effect in the future,

18:36 I think because when you change from,

18:39 "I have to configure a switch manually and via a command line,"

18:43 and then change to, "I'm setting a template,

18:46 I'm setting an intent and then I'll let the system deal with it,"

18:50 that's a different story that works differently from an operational point of view,

18:55 and it works differently from a designer point of view.

18:57 It actually changes your mindset.

18:59 We have seen effects like that,

19:01 as I pointed out with our senior administrators earlier.

19:05 They now think differently than they did two years ago.

19:10 I appreciate you sharing the journey.

19:13 I look at the journey you've been on and look at

19:16 what you've accomplished and what you all have achieved.

19:18 For many, your rearview is the future for what other people are doing,

19:23 and so I appreciate you sharing how you've gotten to where you're going.

19:26 I'm excited to participate in the journey going forward.

19:29 Thanks for the time today and I look forward to continuing the partnership.

19:33 Thanks, Mike. I sure am privileged.