Elias Khnaser, host of the Let’s Talk Shop podcast

Navigating Networking in the Hybrid Cloud: Insights From Kyle Baxter

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Elias Khnaser Headshot
A video screenshot showing Kyle Baxter, Senior Product Manager for Juniper Apstra at Juniper Networks, and Elias Khnaser, host of the Let’s Talk Shop podcast as they talk.

All about intent-based networking

If you’ve wondered about intent-based networking and Juniper Apstra® software, then this video is for you. Watch to learn how intent-based networking puts business goals—rather than command-line interfaces—at the forefront of network operation; then hear about real-world customer use cases and see how Apstra can be used with hybrid cloud-based networks.

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You’ll learn

  • How Apstra industry-standard designs (known as blueprints) work to accelerate your business outcomes

  • How quickly you can get Apstra deployed in your own network

Who is this for?

Network Professionals Business Leaders


Elias Khnaser Headshot
Elias Khnaser
Host of the Let’s Talk Shop podcast
Kyle Baxter Headshot
Kyle Baxter
Senior Product Manager for Juniper Apstra at Juniper Networks


0:00 [Music] coming to you from The Windy City Welcome to Let's Talk Shop a podcast

0:07 about all things cloud and Enterprise Tech listen to insights and guest

0:12 interviews with it thought leaders and professionals now here's your host Elias

0:19 Can Acer welcome back everyone to another episode of let's talk shop today

0:25 is different we are going to move away from all my ex Gartner colleagues from all the cloud the strictly Cloud talk

0:32 and we're going to talk to talk to a vendor that is near and dear to my heart

0:37 I grew up with this vendor during my entire time in the data center they've always been a leader when it came to

0:44 networking so I'm I'm super excited to have a guest from Juniper Networks for

0:51 the first time Kyle Baxter senior product manager for Juniper abstra

0:56 welcome to the show thank you for coming on thank you it's a pleasure I'm excited to

1:01 be a part of your show today I am too so we're going to talk about Juniper abstra

1:07 I haven't been in the data center for a very long time so before I give this

1:13 episode a little bit of a setup tell me about your role at Juniper but tell me more importantly about Juniper abstra if

1:20 I didn't know anything about it summarize it for me go excellent yeah let's do that so as you

1:27 said my name is Kyle Baxter I'm a senior product manager here at Juniper

1:33 um so as my title indicates I work with the engineering team to to lead our

1:38 product and and vision and what we're going to be doing with our solution going forward so what Juniper abstra is

1:48 um let's start from the beginning it was actually a startup that was founded by

1:54 several industry experts former Juniper and Arista engineers and experts that

2:01 decided that the network and especially the data center can be operated in a

2:06 different in a new way there's there's got to be a better way to do it than just driving through the CLI and

2:13 depending on the CLI for everything so that was how it was started in the premise it was started with is to

2:19 completely change how data center networks are managed and drive it through what we call intent so after

2:26 invented the the term called intent based networking instead of driving your network from the CLI the goal is now

2:34 you're driving it from a business intent so what do you want your business outcomes to be and after figures out and

2:40 turns that into the CLI so you no longer need CLI experts you just need General

2:48 Network experts that can know your business outcomes and drive to the

2:54 desired outcomes and it's all done in based on stamped reliable designs so

3:00 that's one of the major Keys is we have what we call Blueprints and so whether it's a small Edge data center or a

3:08 three-stage ipclow fabric or even a large five-stage ipclow fabric we have

3:15 industry standard designs that are repeatable and you know will work every

3:21 time that you just you stamp out and you go off and run on your your business so

3:26 it changes how people think of the data center instead of looking at it as a as

3:32 a cost center it's truly just a pure cost center now it changes it to a way

3:38 where they can drive business outcomes and accelerate their business to new outcomes going forward

3:45 uh I love it and and this is one of the things that I always remember Juniper with is intent based and to be honest

3:52 with you intent based is it it's prior to AI it is the AI right that's you know

3:57 that that was exactly right so the whole point is to just instead of trying to code something or script something or

4:04 integrate something hey just do this for me this is my end result do it for me and all of this gen

4:10 AI type I think is going in that direction I think a lot of the providers be it cloud or some of the traditional

4:16 data center vendors are all moving in into that AI but Juniper was is always

4:21 there first that to be honest with you during my time at Gartner one of the things that I was thinking about is what

4:27 is the maturity model look like for clouds and at one point I was talking about the the kind of the end result of

4:35 where you want to get to from a cloud perspective is being is having an intelligence layer where you can simply

4:41 State my business outcome I'm trying to do this and I want everything else to then

4:46 automatically happens now when I was talking about it it was hey you're kind

4:52 of way into the future but you know with Chad GPT and with you know some of the

4:57 Gen AI it almost now feels like we're pretty close to that so I'm super intrigued and I hope Juniper doesn't

5:04 doesn't let go of the intent based term and the business outcomes and jump on

5:09 this AI stuff because I think you have it exactly right but I want to dwell a little bit more so

5:16 we live in a world where infrastructure is everywhere right it's not just in the data center it's not

5:22 just in the cloud anymore it's everywhere it's at the edge it's in the data center it's in the cloud it's in

5:28 multiple different clouds you have to be able to operate your on-premises

5:33 environment your Edge locations with the same ease the same user experience that you do in the cloud

5:40 so I'm curious from that perspective tell me a little bit about does abstract give me that type of ease that type of

5:48 functionality that I would find with an AWS or an Azure or Google for that matter it absolutely does

5:55 um and and the way we've done it is we've built the the product on on three major pillars that we believe are

6:01 absolutely key to driving a Data Center and to be able to do it at scale and at

6:09 speed the first pillar is is reliability and so while you know it sounds obvious

6:14 you got to have a reliable data center we all know that but it's it's how do you do that and how do you do that at

6:20 speed because everybody wants speed but they also want reliability and the

6:25 way we do that is with those blueprints that I talked about so we have you know validated designs that we can stamp out

6:33 and and repeat and do over and over and you know they're going to work every

6:38 single time we also have continuous validation so as as part of the the

6:44 solution we constantly gather Telemetry and data from all the managed devices and we can constantly and continuously

6:52 compare that against your intent so something deviates or goes out of bounds

6:57 we can alert you immediately and so that way you can take actions and and

7:02 hopefully reduce you know that mean time to repair or or even in cases where the

7:08 network always gets blamed first you can reduce that mean time to innocence

7:14 the the second pillar is the The Experience so Juniper is very focused

7:19 and it's a whole from experience first networking if you go look at any marketing campaigns that's you know

7:24 where we lead and abstra absolutely goes into that that same piece

7:30 um and and like I was talking about from the beginning the the whole goal was to to change how data centers are managed

7:37 and to create more Simplicity ease of use and drastically reduce the the

7:43 complexity because no one no one likes a solution that is complex and expensive to operate and maintain no one wants

7:50 that right so with with intent based networking you can remove that complexity because you no longer have to

7:56 focus on the the CLI and that's a huge win we have you know several customers

8:02 that are you know large Enterprises out there that love that capability because

8:07 now they no longer have to depend on you know highly skilled and certified CLI

8:12 experts and in today's age where you know people are moving and leaving and

8:17 going to other opportunities and they lose that tribal knowledge right that is

8:23 absolutely key and after can keep that you know that single source of Truth and know exactly what's going on in your

8:29 network and so that way you can you can reduce that need one of our customers even said that you know the bottom line

8:35 is you no longer need an engineer that knows Cisco Juniper Arista or Dell or whatever vendor you just need a guy that

8:41 knows how to click with a mouse but well it's maybe a little dramatic yeah yeah I wish it was that easy but I

8:48 get it yeah but but the the point there is that you you have that flexibility

8:54 now to hire um differently you don't have to look at you know what certification do you have

9:00 you just have to see can you you know um understand General Network Concepts

9:05 um and then that blends that that expertise from from your private Cloud to your public cloud

9:11 the the third pillar um is is around multi-vendor um and so this was something that was

9:18 started when when Appster was a startup before it was acquired by Juniper and it's absolutely a key that's going to to

9:25 continue um and and it's been a you know a big value that we've been able to leverage

9:31 um because obviously Supply chains are getting better but Hardware lead times are still sometimes painfully long and

9:39 so what that multi-vendor strategy allows is is now it freeze um companies and and Enterprises from

9:47 that tie-in to a specific vendor so now they can you know play vendors against each other

9:53 um and and do it you know get into a bidding war or who can get them the right Hardware the fastest because you

10:00 know Hardware has become you know more of a commodity yeah it's a commodity you know in a way

10:05 um yes everybody has their own special tweaks but you know the difference between a juniper hardware and Aristo hardware and a Cisco Hardware

10:11 there's very minor differences the difference is how you operate that and that's what app store brings with that

10:18 multi-vendor capability is now no longer what you know switch you can get if you

10:23 need 96 ports you just find whatever Hardware you can get and then you stick it in there and you can know it's going

10:28 to work because of those validated designs so how so tell me a little bit

10:33 about that I'm just so I can understand it so let's say can I get a Cisco switch and then have abstra manage it like

10:40 would it become an abstraction layer or virtualize it or absolutely absolutely so when you're building your

10:47 data center within within appstra you don't ever pick what vendor you want until the very end so you build your

10:54 whole design on your on those intent based business outcomes okay and saying

11:00 for example I want it to be you know a three-stage IV glow fabric with X number of spines and X number of leaves or

11:05 whatever subscription level you want I want you know these mini vlans for for virtual networks and routing zones and

11:11 whatever it is you need and then at the very end you say oh and by the way I want it on Cisco Hardware or Juniper

11:17 Hardware or you know if vendors work together you can mix within a fabric but

11:23 likely you probably don't or you keep certain you know layers in the fabric at

11:28 the same vendor um for just interop ease of mind and

11:34 then it apps or figures out and deduces what the actual CLI configuration is needed based on your intent so it really

11:41 frees you up from you know having to be you know a Cisco July expert or Juniper CLI expert or even narista or whatever

11:48 vendor you just have to know General vendor networking or just general networking terms

11:54 so would that also be the case for let's say a VMware environment how would it work with like let's say NSX would it

12:01 abstract would it integrate like I'm curious now yeah yeah um so we don't necessarily manage you

12:08 know the vcenter in a 60 but we have we definitely have Integrations okay because there's a definite tie-in

12:14 um apps just focus on managing the switches but there's there is specific

12:19 Integrations we have where we can get that what's going on in your virtual networks that are hosted in your racks

12:26 for the switches that are managed by apps are located um so that way you can see is what you

12:31 configured on the virtual side also matching what's configured on the switches because that's a really common

12:38 use case and for errors um is you know mismatching config between you know what's on the virtual

12:44 side versus what's on the actual switch for the network inside and so it can

12:50 flag those and even have you know simple one-click resolutions to resolve those is to fix mismatching configuration

12:58 so what about the edge so you know today there's a lot of these smaller data

13:04 centers let's say um that are spread out um I I'm assuming I can also deliver an

13:10 appliance um virtual or physical to the edge yes yes

13:16 um we have either both use cases Astra is a is a virtual machine um so you can deploy it anywhere

13:23 um so we have use cases of of companies that deploy one instance of Appstore say

13:29 in their headquarters and they you know have you know they have Wan networking to their remote site and you know they

13:36 deploy what we call a like a collapsed Fabric or maybe it's a you know small data where there's you know two two

13:43 switches and a you know basically a very you know like a collapsed spine architecture I mean you can use that

13:48 after instance to manage multiple data centers so you can use it to manage all the ones in your headquarters all your

13:55 remote data centers or Edge data centers we also even have use cases where customers have uh deployed abstra in

14:03 those remote locations if they don't have the right networking or they just don't have the the bandwidth to get the

14:09 right um you know like round trip time because there is a a limit or sure if you get if

14:15 you get over it then it's hard to to manage it especially when we're talking about that continuous validation that's

14:21 where we get stuck sometimes but um but with that we can we can have ways also where we can consolidate those

14:28 views so if you do have multiple instances of abstra you can have a single powerful view on top

14:35 so I'm sure you've heard a lot of folks are continuously optimizing their

14:41 environment there's a lot of focus on costs today there are some applications that were rushed to the cloud that

14:47 shouldn't have been in the cloud in the first place so folks are trying to figure out what to do with them and some

14:52 of the options are to bring them back so I'm curious if you're seeing some of these and how abstra is helping if

14:59 there's any customers that you can name and you know if you can't that's fine I understand but if there are any use

15:05 cases um that are in the public that you can that you can bring up I'd be curious you

15:10 know kind of how they're using abstract in in the real world yeah and there's absolutely use cases

15:16 like that um not saying you know it's a specific customer but you know very public use

15:22 case is uh is zoom everybody got very familiar with with Jim a couple years ago when uh you know the the video

15:29 conferencing exploded and and zoom used the public Cloud to expand fast because

15:34 they couldn't get enough Hardware quick enough um especially as all sudden Supply chains you know Screech to a halt they

15:41 couldn't get their hardware and so they used the public Cloud to expand and what they found and what many other you know

15:48 companies have found as they went to the cloud their margins decreased especially

15:53 when you're talking high intensity you know data types of applications like video conferencing or now it's coming

16:00 with with AI That's become you know the Hot Topic and so we absolutely see lots

16:06 of of customers moving to the back and repatriating applications you know back

16:13 to an on-prem Data Center and Appster can can absolutely help there because

16:19 we've seen a lot of return on investments on you know reducing the time to to stand up a data center

16:26 Forrester even published a report and that's out there publicly on the ROI of

16:32 abstra and what we've seen with a lot of customers that have been doing this kind of activity of standing up new data

16:39 centers to bring applications back on Prem is they sell you know over a 320

16:44 percent ROI when they used abstra 320 percent and that was you know full

16:51 payback with less than six months and they saw savings across the board from from Day Zero where it was you know

16:57 designing you know they were saving 60 percent of time day one it was turning from 24 hours to deploy every single

17:05 device to less than two hours because they could they could they could design everything ahead of time and they just

17:10 could plug the device in and it would get the config and automatically start running and then even to even the more

17:17 powerful part is the day two plus where you're continuing to operate and manage

17:22 that Data Center and they sell you know additional you know 60 plus percent savings there for reducing that mean

17:28 time to repair and in meantime to innocence like we mentioned earlier now is are these numbers compared to the

17:35 cloud or is are these numbers part of like a data center modernization like it's a little more more context yeah

17:41 exactly yeah good good question um so it's compared to using just what

17:46 tools they had today so typically that would be some kind of like ansible or python scripting if they were trying to

17:52 get some scale or just natively within the the CLI um so there was several tools as part of

17:58 that savings that they were able to get rid of so they could get rid of you know the all the ansible scripts they had

18:05 um if they still wanted to keep them they could um they could get rid of you know all the python or other operation tools to

18:11 manage and monitor the devices they were able to consolidate and get rid of a lot of those tools

18:18 so if I were to put you on the spot and ask you about some best practices for

18:24 Network optimization on-premises using abstra what what can you tell me

18:31 yeah yeah so um what we've seen and I'll give you

18:36 some real customer examples I'll start with a a large retail customer so to

18:43 kind of set the stage they used to see hundreds of of cases every day on failed

18:51 shopping carts okay and as we're all familiar in the networking world everybody would blame the network first

18:57 the shopping cart failed because the network you know was slow yeah it was slow had a problem whatever so it's the

19:03 Network's fault so they were always the first to look at cases um and so when they once they deployed

19:09 abstra and it does more than just the the design and build and deploy that's

19:14 where that day two um savings comes into because we were constantly Gathering Telemetry and

19:21 information from the devices to compare against that intent what we were able to do with that that customer is reduce

19:28 their troubleshooting time from from hours down to minutes or even be able to

19:34 provide dashboards because we have dashboards as well that have historical information where they could even show

19:40 it to other teams and they could say see if if the dashboard was green at the

19:46 time the shopping cart failed it wasn't the network wasn't the network let's go look somewhere else

19:51 um so that was that was one um another one that was also really exciting was a large internet hosting

19:58 company and so they used to to have all sorts of outages due to failed Optics

20:04 because they had a fairly large deployment and so they had Optics all over the place and they just couldn't keep up with the the Optics and

20:11 replacing them in time and so they'd have various outages all the time and so with abstra and that information we were

20:18 able to to gather we were able to look at various statistics on the Optics from

20:23 things like power voltage temperature and more to understand when an optic is

20:29 beginning to degrade so we were able to proactively help them reduce and prevent

20:35 issues so they could replace those objects before they failed so then they no longer had outages due to

20:43 um due to failed Optics and so that's where you know they were able to to Leverage leverage what we call

20:49 intent-based analytics and so that's that that constant in continuous validation that I've been talking about

20:55 against the the intent of their design

21:00 fascinating um I I got a probe so

21:06 for a while for a while I thought the innovation has moved completely just to

21:12 the cloud providers but this is like I said the intent base was always interesting to me but now you're making it even more interesting but

21:18 what's coming down the pipe what can you tell me a little bit about the future of

21:25 abstra in particular some of the capabilities that maybe we can expect not holding you to it but maybe we can

21:32 expect yeah yeah so one I'll I'll talk about that's that's quite interesting um you

21:39 kind of hinted at it a little bit um with with AI well you know we want to keep the the core what we've done with

21:46 the intent based networking we also want to explore what we can do with AI to

21:53 enhance the operator's experience and guess what if you're familiar with the Juniper portfolio we have an AI solution

21:59 if you're familiar with our Mist um offering they have a Marvis AI

22:04 component so one of the things we're doing and this isn't just just abstra in the data center but company-wide is how

22:11 can we Leverage What what mist is done with the Marvis Ai and they're they're predictive and proactive analytics and

22:19 Ai and ml models is how can we also Leverage What they've done and bring that to to Data Center use cases or even

22:27 Wan use cases um because because Juniper has a full portfolio of solutions is how can we

22:34 continue to leverage what we have in-house across our portfolio and make more and more Better Together stories

22:41 and so that is something that be on the lookout for what we're going to be doing is we'll augment what we've talked about

22:48 the power of intent based networking and the intent-based analytics and continuous validation with Marvis AI

22:57 and so that's not just to inform right so you mentioned earlier when we were talking that you know one of the the

23:04 advantages is it will be able to notify you very early on so that you can take action right but it's also true that you

23:11 can automate the responses to certain things that happen so that you're always ahead of the

23:17 the situation is that correct correct yeah we have we definitely have that in the product today where we have

23:24 um we don't necessarily Auto remedy the solution um but but we provide you with a button

23:30 because we don't want to push any configuration without you as the operator acknowledging

23:36 um but we'll provide you easy easy buttons for things like you know let's take an easier example

23:41 um miscabling um so say somebody miscabled or you know

23:46 went and changed the cabling um Appster will immediately determine that hey the cabling is wrong and it

23:52 will pull the lldp information and you can in one click say remedy my intent

23:57 with what's actually you know been plugged in and then you can then start

24:03 working again as intended so if any of our viewers or listeners

24:09 are interested to learn more by the way I'm going to have links and a whole bunch of stuff in the show description

24:15 below in the show notes but is there like a live demo environment how do they

24:20 demo app store like give me a little bit of a sense if someone wants to kind of play with it uh how does that work yeah

24:27 yeah exactly we have that we have both a YouTube channel where we have several

24:33 short you know like two to five minute long videos and we'll we'll make sure that's in the in the links as well

24:39 um that that you can go out and watch and see true business outcomes so you can see those things that I was talking

24:45 about and the value that you can get and provide with with abstra and then we also have a solution called abstra Cloud

24:52 Labs where you can sign up and get access to to Labs or pre-deploy

24:59 deployments so whether you want to see you want to see one that's actually already deployed or you want to build it

25:04 from scratch we have labs and lab guides that get give you detailed step-by-step instructions that you can see and then

25:12 also point out that we have these Juniper validated designs that take in

25:17 more than just after and they combine our entire portfolio of solutions so you can you know if you wanted to look at

25:22 how would it actually work with combining uh you know the qfx hardware with abstra with the xrx for security

25:30 and firewalls into a full full-blown solution we have that in Juniper validated designs where you can go look

25:37 at a very detailed white paper interesting So based on your experience

25:43 um how quickly do you can you get abstra to be deployed in an environment realistically like if you know if I'm a

25:49 small business if I'm a medium-sized business if I'm a large business give me all three but how easy would it be to

25:56 get started now you can always optimize you can optimize you know forever right but I'm talking initial deployment what

26:04 would you guesstimate yeah yeah so you know say a user starting from scratch they know nothing

26:10 about about abstra we have um training on our Juniper education

26:16 University Services um we have those three in like five day courses and that's usually enough to get

26:22 somebody um knowledgeable enough that they can start playing with the product um and so then you know maybe another

26:28 you know week or so playing with the product and then once they're ready to deploy it's it's incredibly fast I've

26:35 done demos where I've deployed an entire three-stage ipclow fabric with you know

26:41 with thousands of lines of configuration in minutes in just a few clicks

26:47 um so you know once you've because that's that value of those validated designs and those Stamped Out blueprints

26:52 is in just a few clicks you can say I want this design with these switches and

26:58 off it goes and deploys it and you have now a running Fabric in just minutes

27:05 so I'm also curious is there an offering for a managed service so can someone have Juniper or a juniper trusted

27:12 third-party manage this environment or is it a DIY

27:18 solution so to speak um most of our customers do it

27:24 themselves okay but we do have a handful that wanted to uh to reduce their their

27:31 overhead and so they've engaged whether it's Juniper Professional Services or we have several Partners out there that

27:37 both offer it as various levels of managed services from all the way from you know we'll completely host the

27:44 virtual machine and everything for you to you know we'll we'll help you get

27:49 started and give you training um in anywhere in between so we do have offerings via whether it's Juniper

27:55 Professional Services or or our partner community interesting so I'm I'm super intrigued

28:03 um I hope everyone that's watching is as well and I'd love to hear from you from you all if if we should bring Kyle back

28:10 for a demo of abstra and maybe he can show us the product because you know as you were talking I couldn't help you

28:16 know but but Wonder Hey you know this would be really great if I could see some of these things so yeah maybe in

28:22 the next few months here as we get into conference season for everyone maybe you

28:28 and I or You and I and someone else maybe we can we can do a live demo of some of the things that you're talking

28:33 about hopefully there'll be some newer announcements also that we can uh that we can show especially the AI uh portion

28:39 that you mentioned I think that would be that would be incredibly fascinating um absolutely I'd love to come back on

28:46 and do that what else didn't I ask you what are you hearing from customers what else should folks know about abstra

28:53 about about the the environment in general today any interesting insights that you want that you'd like to share

29:00 yeah one thing we didn't touch on was the developer experience um as you know the the scale and

29:07 evolution of data centers people are looking to do things faster and and even

29:13 get away from even just clicking in the UI they want to take it to the next you know the next stage and completely

29:19 automate it and why we have a full set of of apis our UI is actually a

29:25 first-class citizen of our of our API so every API or UI is actually utilizing

29:31 um but where we're seeing is is these customers want to take that to the next level and so what we're doing is things

29:37 with uh with things like Postman Collections and sdks to give examples

29:42 and ways to get started plus what what everybody's getting to is terraform

29:48 terraform's kind of the the new devops you know preferred tool and so we have a

29:54 recently launched terraform abstra provider that's that's out there that

29:59 that people can go out get get started with and try because that's where

30:05 probably we see a lot of the evolution of where a lot of our customers and

30:11 Enterprises in general are going to be moving towards is how can they take that to the next level and and bring in more

30:18 automation um to it you know think of being able to as a user being able to open up a case

30:25 and say Hey I want a new service deployed and it's going to require a you know a new rack and some new virtual

30:30 lands and servers deployed and you could potentially automate all that from creating a ticket and service now to

30:37 fully deploying your your service and nobody has to touch anything maybe some approvals in there but nobody would have

30:44 to actually touch any UI or do any of the configuration it could be fully automated based on you know how you want

30:51 your your environment set up that's where we see a lot of um promise and and where we see a lot of

30:58 the future going towards I'm gonna throw one more at you I can't help it you're you're just you're you

31:04 know you keep asking you know you keep saying things and my mind's going in a million different direction I love it how how long before or maybe we're

31:13 already there before abstra becomes application aware so if

31:18 the application let's say is having a hard time from a network perspective is you know maybe it's too

31:25 much Network traffic maybe there's a lot of latency is it able to rectify the

31:31 problem automatically or is it just going to notify me as quickly as possible so that I can take action and

31:38 if it's the latter will it have recommendations or is it just flagging that the application is

31:45 is having a networking issue great question so what we're doing is we're

31:51 bringing more flow data analytics later this year to begin to get that that type

31:58 of information so we can get that Network observability and deep insights into what's going on

32:03 inside your network traffic and we can you know be able to to start with

32:09 layering on you know the alerting what you talked about to let you know when there is issues or say there is a

32:15 network issue what applications are impacted or who's consuming all that bandwidth or who's hitting your Cloud

32:22 egress cost or um or or you know security vulnerabilities you know are you getting

32:28 you know attacked from the outside um all sorts of use cases where then we

32:34 can get to your other point is can you have more you know actionable um

32:40 insights or options that's where potentially that that Marvis integration

32:46 and what we'll be doing in you know likely more next year is can we then take all that information leverage the

32:53 capabilities that Marvis has within Mist which you can already do some of those kinds of capabilities in the missed

33:00 cloud with campus infrastructures and we can bring that to the data center and be

33:05 able to provide you know actions and recommended and maybe even one day proactively resolve issues before before

33:13 they go bad exactly yeah a Minority Report type of situation

33:19 exactly I've I've been saying for a while that I think the world's going to be very different six months from now

33:25 than it is today across the board all Technologies are going to to integrate

33:31 to leverage to take advantage of this this AI hype that just exploded and I am

33:37 super excited to see what Juniper does with it and based on some of the things that you've mentioned here today I think

33:43 when the next time we talk uh this is going to be a superintendo thing but let's see what happens with the demo

33:49 maybe we do a demo uh real soon and then maybe we'll do something else towards the end of the year that'll be super

33:54 interesting especially how you're going to integrate um Marvis and Mist into

34:01 um into this I think that'll be that'll be fascinating Kyle exactly thank you so much for

34:07 making time thank you so much for coming on the show I I learned a heck of a lot and um I'm gonna keep an eye on you guys

34:14 see see kind of how this is uh this is going to progress definitely it was a pleasure thank you

34:19 for letting me join and hopefully we'll get a chance to to do it again and we'll get some live demos and see this in

34:25 action absolutely all right and with that we'll see you all in the next show

34:32 thank you [Music] thank you

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